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 Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage

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nathan7878
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PostSubject: Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage   Wed 10 Jul 2013, 23:09

This is something that I thought I could forget about, but it still just bothers me because I don't think
it has been done in a 100% no Action Replay code free way on SSF or a real Sega Saturn.

Obviously from the topic title, I am talking about the Max Game Percentage on Sega Saturn in a legit way,
no Action Replay codes.

As most of us know, (and a lot of you guys helped create)...

was the technique of using S4R on Sega Saturn to be able to completely white out both maps...



and in the process discovered Matrix rooms, being a room or location on the map in
which your rooms number would increase automatically while standing still, giving
us the ability to gain huge game percentages on Saturn....for example, Pualo shows
his percentage on SSF in the video to be 121,005.6

After I saw this video on Youtube.com, I personally could not stop thinking about
what the max percentage on Saturn could actually be...so being a Action Replay nerd geek...

I was able to write a code that could create a Matrix room any where in the castle,
and another code that would increase the amount of rooms you gained in a Matrix room
from hundreds per a second...to hundreds of thousands per second.


and finally discovering 42926080 rooms or 4,556,908.7 percent, was the highest before the
percentage would reset back to 0...and with the codes on this would only take about 30 minutes
to and hour or so.

But even after this my curiosity still lingers to the place of wanting to see the percentage of 4,556,908.7
reached with out the use of Action Replay codes...this would mean having to stay in a Matrix room for
roughly 5 days Shocked... about 1 million rooms per 3 hours.

So as most testing goes...this should obviously be tested first on SSF for the sake of save states...and if
if was successful, I would be willing to risk testing it out on my real white Japanese Sega Saturn, for the sake of knowledge. lol! 
Which a new problem arises of would a Sega Saturn be able to stay on for 2 or 5 days straight with out over heating...affraid 

Unfortunately, the computer I had all my SSF files on was damaged awhile ago, so I lost my saves.
I do not mine doing the testing on SSF but I need at least a cleared game file, preferably a skip death luck cleared file or
a 85 HP start cleared file.

So if some one would not mine donating one to me, or knows where to find Dracula X SSF save
files...it would really speed up the testing Very Happy...

or if some one else would like to do the testing, that would be sufficient as well.


Last edited by nathan7878 on Sat 10 Aug 2013, 04:45; edited 3 times in total
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PostSubject: Re: Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage   Sat 13 Jul 2013, 16:03

I found a SSF cleared save file here http://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4794.0;attach=2347
So I will start S4R today Cool
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PostSubject: Re: Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage   Sun 14 Jul 2013, 16:18

nathan7878 wrote:
This is something that I thought I could forget about, but it still just bothers me because I don't think
it has been done in a 100% no Action Replay code free way on SSF or a real Sega Saturn.

(...)

and finally discovering 42926080 rooms or 4,556,908.7 percent, was the highest before the
percentage would reset back to 0...and with the codes on this would only take about 30 minutes
to and hour or so.

(...)

So as most testing goes...this should obviously be tested first on SSF for the sake of save states...and if
if was successful, I would be willing to risk testing it out on my real white Japanese Sega Saturn, for the sake of knowledge. lol! 
Which a new problem arises of would a Sega Saturn be able to stay on for 2 or 5 days straight with out over heating...affraid 

Nice idea, arukado started to test it when the tech was founded but never shared/finished his try. You can increase the emulator fps and reach the max % faster! Using a real saturn is not good, I agree lol

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PostSubject: Re: Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage   Sat 20 Jul 2013, 01:51

Yeah, I will definitely turn up the fps...

It takes about 45 X4hr when leaving the first map to get to the right place on the second map.



Slowly but surely, LOL.

I'm thinking splitting the 42926080 rooms between the 2 matrix rooms on this run, and the real run.
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PostSubject: Re: Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage   Sun 21 Jul 2013, 14:13

This is the math behind the s4r on saturn. I did it long time ago and posted on the old WBW:

paulo1179 wrote:
I created two mathematic expressions to be used in the infinite shift rooms techs.


In this techs, we can use a "big" map that includes the first and second castles.


Turnning 180° the IC map to build a unique map:



Look to the map below (start in 1 and finish in 64 vertical). I'll use it to tell how the expressions work with examples (all in Castle Keep):




[size=134]EQUATIONS:[/size]


I)     Vf + (Hf/64) = (64xVi + Hi + NxS)/64

II)    S = (64xVf - 64xVi + Hf - Hi)/N


S: number of shifts;
N: number of rooms shifted in each single shift;
Hi: initial position in the horizontal scale;
Vi: initial position in the vertical scale;
Hf: final position in the horizontal scale;
Vf: final position in the vertical scale.


Ex1) What's the final position of the 'A' room if you shift 22 times using the s6r?

S: 22   (shifts)
N: 6   (s6r)
Hi: 37   (map)
Vi: 6   (map)  
Hf: ?
Vf: ?

Pick the first equation:

Vf + (Hf/64) = (64xVi + Hi + NxS)/64

Vf + (Hf/64) = (64x6 + 37 + 6x22)/64

Vf + (Hf/64) = 8.640625

Vf = 8

Hf = 0.640625x64 = 41

Vf = 8; Hf = 41            EXACTLY


Ex2 IMPORTANT) What's the final position of the 'B' room if you shift 15 times using the s6r?

S: 15   (shifts)
N: 6   (s6r)
Hi: 38   (map)
Vi: 10   (map)  
Hf: ?
Vf: ?

Pick the first equation:

Vf + (Hf/64) = (64xVi + Hi + NxS)/64

Vf + (Hf/64) = (64x10 + 38 + 6x15)/64

Vf + (Hf/64) = 12

When you get a perfect integer it means last position in the line above this number:

Vf = 11; Hf = 64           EXACTLY


Ex3) What's the final position of the 'A' room if you shift 1 time using the s6r then shift 50 times using the s12r ?

*It's very common use a initial shift different than the others in the Saturn version.

You don't need to use equation to know where the first shift reaches:

V = 6 ; H = 43

S: 50   (shifts)
N: 12   (s12r)
Hi: 43   (H)
Vi: 6   (V)  
Hf: ?
Vf: ?

Pick the first equation:

Vf + (Hf/64) = (64xVi + Hi + NxS)/64

Vf + (Hf/64) = (64x6 + 43 + 12x50)/64

Vf + (Hf/64) = 16.046875

Vf = 16

Hf = 0.046875x64 = 3

Vf = 16; Hf = 3             EXACTLY


Ex4) What's the number of shifts to reach the position V=19; H=45 with the 'A' room using s12r?

S: ?   (shifts)
N: 12   (s12r)
Hi: 37   (map)
Vi: 6   (map)  
Hf: 45   (H)
Vf: 19   (V)

Pick the second equation:

S = (64xVf - 64xVi + Hf - Hi)/N

S = (64x19 - 64x6 + 45 - 37)/12

S = 70           EXACTLY


Ex5) What's the number of shifts to reach the position V= 20; H=45 with the 'A' room using s12r?

S: ?   (shifts)
N: 12   (s12r)
Hi: 37   (map)
Vi: 6   (map)  
Hf: 45   (H)
Vf: 20   (V)

Pick the second equation:

S = (64xVf - 64xVi + Hf - Hi)/N

S = (64x20 - 64x6 + 45 - 37)/12

S = 75.333333333333333333333333333333

The 'A' room WILL NOT reach the position Vf=20; Hf=45 if you only use s12r.

*But: 75,33333... is equal 75 + 1/3

Do 75 s12r then 1 s4r to reach this room.


That's all!!! ^^

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PostSubject: Re: Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage   Sun 21 Jul 2013, 20:43

Awesome, I always love reading stuff like this.
I just hit the first Matrix room...

So I should be at 21,000,000 rooms in about 3 or 4 days...considering down time for my pc to rest.

I wonder if having a percent as high as 4,556,908.7 on Saturn could possibly help develop a infinite HMU/LMU glitch scratch...

since the infinite HMU/LMU glitch on PSX has a lot to do with game percentage.

Or what if we could create a matrix room in a location with HMU/LMU's scratch ...maybe it could cause them to reappear.

I will do some testing with Action Replay codes.
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PostSubject: Re: Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage   Tue 23 Jul 2013, 00:09

I am not sure exactly what impact the % needed to activate infinity. I know it has to have some minor effect but the % needed above 200% is not much. I think it was not even 210%. Infinity is so weird that way, how can random actions create such a lovely effect. its different on each console and each version.
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PostSubject: Re: Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage   Tue 23 Jul 2013, 03:14

Pale-Dim wrote:
Infinity is so weird that way, how can random actions create such a lovely effect.

I agree, and from all the videos of doing the infinity glitch we know that the glitch has a lot to do with over loading the game
with information and actions...the percentage being a essential part of the information overload.  

That's what made me think up this formula, as to why the infinity glitch may have been unsuccessful on Saturn so far.

Lets say for mathematical purposes, that it takes a minimum of 200.0 on PSX to activate the infinity glitch.

The maximum game percentage on PSX is 6957.0, before it resets back to 0.0

200.0 is what percentage of 6957.0? it is 2.87480235734

So for information overload on PSX, 2.87480235734 of the maximum game percentage must be met.




The maximum game percentage on Saturn is 4556908.7, before it resets back to 0.0

It could be possible on Saturn, similar to PSX, that 2.87480235734 of the maximum game percentage needs to
be met before there is information overload.

So a percentage of about 131002.12 on Saturn would be needed if this was true.



Right now, the luck-skip death save file that I am testing with is at 218835.6, so high enough to meet the parameters.
If anybody wants to do any infinity glitch testing, here is a copy... mediafire.com download/yba7djraau9dxtp/DRACULAX_01.bin

Also, I have had some strange things happen during testing in matrix room 1, I am not gaining rooms as fast as I first calculated.
So it will take longer to reach the goal of 21 million in the matrix room 1, it could even take a week or 2 Evil or Very Mad...
and once my file reached about 218835.6 or so, my walk armor went from 999 Def to 0 Def...yeah, that sucks...it may
just be resetting, so I will update if the walk armor begins to raise its Def back up.


If anyone is not familiar with how to do the infinity glitch, here is some variations of what works on PSX.

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PostSubject: Re: Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage   Fri 26 Jul 2013, 16:44

Ok, like I said before, for some reason when you are standing still in Matrix room 1, after about 10 minutes
the amount of rooms you are gaining starts to slow drastically...so the best place to stand is here...

That way you are being hit by the Axe Knight ever minute or so, you only lose 1 HP, and this prevents the slow down...just refill
your hp every 12 hours or so and keep the fairy familiar on for safety.

Thankfully, my walk armor did actually go back up to 999 DEF, but then went back to 0, so the walk
armor is looping...so hopefully the walk armor will be at 999 DEF when I stop at the max game percentage.



Were at 10 million, just 11 million more to go in Matrix room 1...lol!


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PostSubject: Re: Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage   Fri 26 Jul 2013, 20:47

Great. I like the Axe lord trick XD. I cant wait to see your results! I'LL ask you to do the same with the Matrix 2 Cool 

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PostSubject: Re: Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage   Thu 01 Aug 2013, 22:53

Ok, 21,174,826 Rooms gained in Matrix room 1...








and now starting in Matrix room 2... cyclops 

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PostSubject: Re: Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage   Fri 02 Aug 2013, 20:18

is there any video's available of the matrix rooms activations. I don't much knowledge of these techs since i never played saturn version much and would like to get to know them so i can try them out one day. I know they involve backdash or some sort of dash between certain doorways but thats about it. Can you link any video's. thanks!
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PostSubject: Re: Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage   Fri 02 Aug 2013, 20:53

Pale-Dim wrote:
is there any video's available of the matrix rooms activations.  I don't much knowledge of these techs since i never played saturn version much and would like to get to know them so i can try them out one day.  I know they involve backdash or some sort of dash between certain doorways but thats about it.  Can you link any video's.  thanks!

Here you can see everything - step by step - http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=xNbLDiGFlD4

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PostSubject: Re: Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage   Wed 07 Aug 2013, 17:47

Ok guys, big news....While nearing 40,000,000 rooms, I decided to do some testing in the matrix room 2 with the
No Walls Action Replay code on....and I discovered 3 strange load spots under the Matrix room affraid


The first load spot is under the right side of the matrix room pretty far down.
when you hit this spot you will be sent to a glitched game over screen...and then the game will reset.


The second load spot is very, very far under the right side of the matrix room.
This load spot will teleport you (like a library card) to a glitched version of the inverted castle keep...then from there the glitched
castle seems to be fully explore-able...both inverted and normal castle.

In this glitched castle if you try to enter your menu screen the game will freeze, I think this happens because this is a glitched version of
the castle in Richter or Maria mode...notice when I go to the library the librarian is facing the wrong way.

If you save in the glitched castle it will corrupted the save file, and the save file will become unload able.





The third load spot/glitched spot (and the one I find most important) is under the left side of the matrix room...it is
pretty far down...but could most likely be reached with heart refreshers Very Happy When this spot is reached your HP, MP, LUCK and BEAT
are instantly raised into the hundred thousands (or millions, its kinda hard to tell)...LOL


and having your LUCK in the millions gives you the ability to become invincible with the talisman item...



Ok, so for us to make this possible, I need to get out of the shifted Anti-chapel, so I can start using the HR's to sink...what would be the quickest way to get out of the shifted Anti-chapel scratch


Here is a save state in Matrix room 2/one shift away from the game crashing...if anyone wants to do any testing.
Just put it in your SSF StateSave/Saturn folder...and it should load. mediafire.com download/x9hsv9h6612hrc3/DRACULA_X_9.bin
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PostSubject: Re: Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage   Wed 07 Aug 2013, 21:03

Nice findings. \o/

1-Where is the "new" castle keep? Check the maps and look where you are!

2-Matrix room is not a place. It is a condition where weird glitches will happen (you can reach matrix on tons of different locations). Try to use the maths that I posted before to calculate where exactly the load spots are. The idea is find the locations of everything!

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PostSubject: Re: Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage   Thu 08 Aug 2013, 23:53

I have an idea. Try to complete a block of rooms above the passageway when shifiting (without going to the area below). You can go further with this trick and shift more times, maybe we can reach the load spots and skip the game crash.

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PostSubject: Re: Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage   Fri 09 Aug 2013, 15:32

paulo1179 wrote:
1-Where is the "new" castle keep? Check the maps and look where you are!
The glitched inverted castle keep is in the same place as the regular inverted castle keep.

paulo1179 wrote:
I have an idea. Try to complete a block of rooms above the passageway when shifiting (without going to the area below). You can go further with this trick and shift more times, maybe we can reach the load spots and skip the game crash.
Even when I complete the blocks above the passageway, the game still crashes when I shift, but I agree...we need
to find a way to keep shifting or find a way to get out of the anti-chapel so we can sink with heart refreshers.

Any idea's on how we can get out of the anti-chapel scratch 

Here is a video to better explain the loading areas...
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PostSubject: Re: Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage   Fri 09 Aug 2013, 19:50

nathan7878 wrote:


Any idea's on how we can get out of the anti-chapel scratch 

Dive kick + DHR on the blocked passageway.You'll fall through the left side of the tower. Wink





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PostSubject: Re: Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage   Sat 10 Aug 2013, 18:41

So I was wrong, the max game percentage on Sega Saturn is not 4,556,908.7

The max game percentage that can be achieved in the Matrix rooms is...

4,559,413.2



or 42949672 Rooms



any rooms over that will reset your percentage back to 0.0% ...and unfortunately walk armor is at 0 DEF Evil or Very Mad 

If you want to do the HP, MP, LUCK & Murumasa Glitch and still get the max game percentage then start the
glitch with about 42949172 rooms...this way you will not go over the max game percentage...and you can pick up
the rest of the rooms when falling during the glitch Smile


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PostSubject: Re: Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage   Sat 10 Aug 2013, 19:43

Great job. Thank you very much for testing it!

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PostSubject: Re: Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage   Sun 11 Aug 2013, 18:27

Can you upload your saturn bios? Your savestate file does not work here. Maybe we are using different bios.

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PostSubject: Re: Saturn S4R Max Game Percentage   Sun 11 Aug 2013, 20:53

Ok, I figured out why its not working...I was not play with a bios when I made the save states,
so, remove your bios and then try it.
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